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	<title>Comments on: The &#8220;National Popular Vote&#8221; plan?</title>
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	<description>Don&#039;t dis or dismiss this miss!</description>
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		<title>By: stackja</title>
		<link>http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-712605</link>
		<dc:creator>stackja</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jul 2007 01:31:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/#comment-712605</guid>
		<description>POTUS or POTCalif-NY</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>POTUS or POTCalif-NY</p>
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		<title>By: Drewsmom</title>
		<link>http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-712555</link>
		<dc:creator>Drewsmom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Jun 2007 09:53:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/#comment-712555</guid>
		<description>Bad idea, the loons would be stealing every election if they are from big states.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bad idea, the loons would be stealing every election if they are from big states.</p>
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		<title>By: Great White Rat</title>
		<link>http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-712541</link>
		<dc:creator>Great White Rat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Jun 2007 02:29:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/#comment-712541</guid>
		<description>First of all, the idea of getting rid of the Electoral College is not going to happen.  To do that, you need a constitutional amendment, which requires approval by 38 states.  There&#039;s no way the smaller states are going to voluntarily surrender their say in national elections.  So this idea is DOA anyhow.

Beyond that, the idea loses sight of the fact that we have a &lt;strong&gt;federal&lt;/strong&gt; government.  The individual states are &lt;em&gt;supposed&lt;/em&gt; to have some power over the process.  If a so-called National Popular Vote plan were put in place, citizens of states like Delaware and South Dakota could forget about ever seeing a presidential candidate.  Why bother, when you can concentrate on running up a bigger majority in LA or NYC?

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.ncpa.org/oped/bartlett/nov2000.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Bruce Bartlett&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt; makes several good points, among them this one:
&lt;blockquote&gt;Advertising necessarily will shift away from local markets to national media. The principal impact of this will be to raise the cost of campaigning.
... 
If the cost of running for president rises, then there is going to be increased pressure on taxpayers to chip in more money for federal subsidies and more complaints about fundraising abuses, soft money and the like.
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

That doesn&#039;t mean individual states can&#039;t alter their own laws on distribution of electors.  Maine and Nebraska currently have laws close to what arcman proposes.  That&#039;s fine if that&#039;s what the citizens of the state want, and it doesn&#039;t run afoul of the constitution.  But the whole idea of direct popular vote election of the president is a can of worms we should not think about opening.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First of all, the idea of getting rid of the Electoral College is not going to happen.  To do that, you need a constitutional amendment, which requires approval by 38 states.  There&#8217;s no way the smaller states are going to voluntarily surrender their say in national elections.  So this idea is DOA anyhow.</p>
<p>Beyond that, the idea loses sight of the fact that we have a <strong>federal</strong> government.  The individual states are <em>supposed</em> to have some power over the process.  If a so-called National Popular Vote plan were put in place, citizens of states like Delaware and South Dakota could forget about ever seeing a presidential candidate.  Why bother, when you can concentrate on running up a bigger majority in LA or NYC?</p>
<p><a href="http://www.ncpa.org/oped/bartlett/nov2000.html" rel="nofollow"><strong>Bruce Bartlett</strong></a> makes several good points, among them this one:</p>
<blockquote><p>Advertising necessarily will shift away from local markets to national media. The principal impact of this will be to raise the cost of campaigning.<br />
&#8230;<br />
If the cost of running for president rises, then there is going to be increased pressure on taxpayers to chip in more money for federal subsidies and more complaints about fundraising abuses, soft money and the like.
</p></blockquote>
<p>That doesn&#8217;t mean individual states can&#8217;t alter their own laws on distribution of electors.  Maine and Nebraska currently have laws close to what arcman proposes.  That&#8217;s fine if that&#8217;s what the citizens of the state want, and it doesn&#8217;t run afoul of the constitution.  But the whole idea of direct popular vote election of the president is a can of worms we should not think about opening.</p>
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		<title>By: PCD</title>
		<link>http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-712522</link>
		<dc:creator>PCD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 18:40:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/#comment-712522</guid>
		<description>Who is PCB, Lard???</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who is PCB, Lard???</p>
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		<title>By: Lorica</title>
		<link>http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-712517</link>
		<dc:creator>Lorica</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 17:54:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/#comment-712517</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Respectfully, PCB is reiterating conventional wisdom that doesn&#039;t hold up when you look at the numbers. If one presdiential candidate were to receive 75% of the vote in the 100 largest cities in the US, that is still less than 1/2 the votes necessary to get elected President under a national popular vote plan. Do the math. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

Sooo the top 200 cities out of the 25,000-30,000 cities in the United States are going to be able to pick the President??  Nice!!! All a Candidate would have to do is pander to the larger cities, and bada boom bada bing they are the next President of the United States.  This is completely illogical, the whole point of the electoral college is to neurtalize the effect of the larger states over the smaller states.  Also, any and all state laws along these lines are going to have to go under constitutional muster, and they ain&#039;t gonna make it.  This is more waste of time from polititians who apparently have too much time on their hands.  

I just checked an Electoral College Map and you would have to win the top 11 states in order to be over the 263 Electoral Votes to win.  
55 California
34 Texas
31 New York
27 Florida
21 Illinois
21 Pennsylvania  
Are the top 6 and only get you 189 votes

You would also have to win:
20 Ohio
17 Michigan
15 New Jersey
15 Georgia
15 North Carolina 
The home state of my Very Favorite Blog Mistress

Those states put you over the top Electorially, so to speak.  With the popular vote you could have California and New York conspire together to vote for a specific candidate and trump virtually every other state in the union.  Just CA and NY have a voting population that is over half of the votes that John Kerry received in 2004.  Why should the rest of the states be held hostage to what those two states want???  I know this is a simplistic analysis, and I completely understand that not everyone in CA or NY are going to vote for a specific candidate, but I also only see this as cry baby antics cuz Al Gore lost the 2000 elections. - Lorica</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Respectfully, PCB is reiterating conventional wisdom that doesn&#8217;t hold up when you look at the numbers. If one presdiential candidate were to receive 75% of the vote in the 100 largest cities in the US, that is still less than 1/2 the votes necessary to get elected President under a national popular vote plan. Do the math. </p></blockquote>
<p>Sooo the top 200 cities out of the 25,000-30,000 cities in the United States are going to be able to pick the President??  Nice!!! All a Candidate would have to do is pander to the larger cities, and bada boom bada bing they are the next President of the United States.  This is completely illogical, the whole point of the electoral college is to neurtalize the effect of the larger states over the smaller states.  Also, any and all state laws along these lines are going to have to go under constitutional muster, and they ain&#8217;t gonna make it.  This is more waste of time from polititians who apparently have too much time on their hands.  </p>
<p>I just checked an Electoral College Map and you would have to win the top 11 states in order to be over the 263 Electoral Votes to win.<br />
55 California<br />
34 Texas<br />
31 New York<br />
27 Florida<br />
21 Illinois<br />
21 Pennsylvania<br />
Are the top 6 and only get you 189 votes</p>
<p>You would also have to win:<br />
20 Ohio<br />
17 Michigan<br />
15 New Jersey<br />
15 Georgia<br />
15 North Carolina<br />
The home state of my Very Favorite Blog Mistress</p>
<p>Those states put you over the top Electorially, so to speak.  With the popular vote you could have California and New York conspire together to vote for a specific candidate and trump virtually every other state in the union.  Just CA and NY have a voting population that is over half of the votes that John Kerry received in 2004.  Why should the rest of the states be held hostage to what those two states want???  I know this is a simplistic analysis, and I completely understand that not everyone in CA or NY are going to vote for a specific candidate, but I also only see this as cry baby antics cuz Al Gore lost the 2000 elections. &#8211; Lorica</p>
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		<title>By: Lars</title>
		<link>http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-712514</link>
		<dc:creator>Lars</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 16:30:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/#comment-712514</guid>
		<description>Respectfully, PCB is reiterating conventional wisdom that doesn&#039;t hold up when you look at the numbers.  If one presdiential candidate were to receive 75% of the vote in the 100 largest cities in the US, that is still less than 1/2 the votes necessary to get elected President under a national popular vote plan.  Do the math.  

Candidate will have to compete for every vote.  It will not matter to them if they get it from a big city or a rural area.  Any candidate who focuses all or even a significant majority of their time in big cities is destined to lose.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Respectfully, PCB is reiterating conventional wisdom that doesn&#8217;t hold up when you look at the numbers.  If one presdiential candidate were to receive 75% of the vote in the 100 largest cities in the US, that is still less than 1/2 the votes necessary to get elected President under a national popular vote plan.  Do the math.  </p>
<p>Candidate will have to compete for every vote.  It will not matter to them if they get it from a big city or a rural area.  Any candidate who focuses all or even a significant majority of their time in big cities is destined to lose.</p>
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		<title>By: Leslie</title>
		<link>http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-712507</link>
		<dc:creator>Leslie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 13:55:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/#comment-712507</guid>
		<description>I&#039;d say arcman and joreko have it just right. Thanks guys.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d say arcman and joreko have it just right. Thanks guys.</p>
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		<title>By: PCD</title>
		<link>http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-712503</link>
		<dc:creator>PCD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 12:55:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/#comment-712503</guid>
		<description>I love how the Liberals spin.  The Founding Fathers had it right.  The Sorelosermen want to have it that large cities like NYC and Chicago where they can manufacture votes will elect the President since they can&#039;t play by the rules in the first place.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love how the Liberals spin.  The Founding Fathers had it right.  The Sorelosermen want to have it that large cities like NYC and Chicago where they can manufacture votes will elect the President since they can&#8217;t play by the rules in the first place.</p>
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		<title>By: joreko</title>
		<link>http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-712501</link>
		<dc:creator>joreko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 12:45:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/#comment-712501</guid>
		<description>Michael says &quot;The problem with ... national popular vote... is that presidential candidates would only need to carry about 6 states to win.&quot;  That&#039;s THE problem with the current system --- NOT with a nationwide vote for President in which every vote is equal throughout the country.  Under the CURRENT system, it matters who CARRIES the closely divided battleground states. Under a national popular vote, the idea is not to carry any particular state, but to get the most votes throughout the country.  

The major shortcoming of the current system arises from the winner-take-all rule (currently used by 48 states) under which all of a state&#039;s electoral votes to the candidate who gets the most votes in the state. If the partisan divide in a state is not initially closer than about 46%-54%, no amount of campaigning during a brief presidential campaign is realistically going to change the winner of the state. As a result, presidential candidates have no reason to poll, visit, advertise, organize, campaign, or worry about the concerns of voters of states that they cannot possibly win or lose. North Carolina is among the 40-some states that are totally ignored in presidential campaigns. Instead, candidates concentrate their attention on a handful of &quot;battleground&quot; states. 88% of the money is focused onto just 9 closely divided battleground states: Ohio, Florida, Michigan, Pennsylvania, Iowa, Minnesota, Wisconsin, New Mexico, and New Hampshire.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Michael says &#8220;The problem with &#8230; national popular vote&#8230; is that presidential candidates would only need to carry about 6 states to win.&#8221;  That&#8217;s THE problem with the current system &#8212; NOT with a nationwide vote for President in which every vote is equal throughout the country.  Under the CURRENT system, it matters who CARRIES the closely divided battleground states. Under a national popular vote, the idea is not to carry any particular state, but to get the most votes throughout the country.  </p>
<p>The major shortcoming of the current system arises from the winner-take-all rule (currently used by 48 states) under which all of a state&#8217;s electoral votes to the candidate who gets the most votes in the state. If the partisan divide in a state is not initially closer than about 46%-54%, no amount of campaigning during a brief presidential campaign is realistically going to change the winner of the state. As a result, presidential candidates have no reason to poll, visit, advertise, organize, campaign, or worry about the concerns of voters of states that they cannot possibly win or lose. North Carolina is among the 40-some states that are totally ignored in presidential campaigns. Instead, candidates concentrate their attention on a handful of &#8220;battleground&#8221; states. 88% of the money is focused onto just 9 closely divided battleground states: Ohio, Florida, Michigan, Pennsylvania, Iowa, Minnesota, Wisconsin, New Mexico, and New Hampshire.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael</title>
		<link>http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-712493</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 07:15:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/#comment-712493</guid>
		<description>The problem with just going by the national popular vote, or apportioning electoral votes based on percentage of the popular vote won, is that presidential candidates would only need to carry about 6 states to win.  The rest of the country would become irrelevant.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem with just going by the national popular vote, or apportioning electoral votes based on percentage of the popular vote won, is that presidential candidates would only need to carry about 6 states to win.  The rest of the country would become irrelevant.</p>
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		<title>By: arcman</title>
		<link>http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-712486</link>
		<dc:creator>arcman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 05:37:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/#comment-712486</guid>
		<description>The solution to the electoral college problem that I have touted for quite a while is pretty simple.  If a state has, for example 2 Senators, and ten Representatives then they have 12 electoral votes.  If Candidate A gets 60% of the vote and Candidate B gets 40% then Candidate A gets 2 electoral votes for winning the state election.  Candidate A then gets 6 electoral votes and Candidate B gets 4 electoral votes.  This would make states like California, New York and those that have large amounts of electoral votes more competitive.  As it is say the state of California, which has 55 electoral votes has a candidate that wins 53% of the vote.  Because it is a winner take all system 55 electoral votes goes to that candidate.  Say the candidate wins 70% again same result.  Under my plan said candidate would receive 2 electoral votes for winning the state, then 28 more for a total of 30 votes.  The opponent, who won 47% would then get 25 votes.  I think that would put every state in play, thus making it more fair, and would be more accurate to the way the country had voted in the popular election.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The solution to the electoral college problem that I have touted for quite a while is pretty simple.  If a state has, for example 2 Senators, and ten Representatives then they have 12 electoral votes.  If Candidate A gets 60% of the vote and Candidate B gets 40% then Candidate A gets 2 electoral votes for winning the state election.  Candidate A then gets 6 electoral votes and Candidate B gets 4 electoral votes.  This would make states like California, New York and those that have large amounts of electoral votes more competitive.  As it is say the state of California, which has 55 electoral votes has a candidate that wins 53% of the vote.  Because it is a winner take all system 55 electoral votes goes to that candidate.  Say the candidate wins 70% again same result.  Under my plan said candidate would receive 2 electoral votes for winning the state, then 28 more for a total of 30 votes.  The opponent, who won 47% would then get 25 votes.  I think that would put every state in play, thus making it more fair, and would be more accurate to the way the country had voted in the popular election.</p>
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		<title>By: Lars</title>
		<link>http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/comment-page-1/#comment-712482</link>
		<dc:creator>Lars</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 05:06:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/2007/06/28/the-national-popular-vote-plan/#comment-712482</guid>
		<description>I think this plan makes a lot of sense.  If I understand it correctly, it boils down to the simple premise that the candidate that receives the most votes should win the election.  

It will also force candidates to campaign everywhere.  Currently they ignore most of the country and focus exclusively on battleground states.  This skews the campaign so they discuss issues like the US-Cuba relationship because it is important in Florida.  The US-Mexico relationship is virtually ignored because candidates don&#039;t have to campaign in California, or Texas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think this plan makes a lot of sense.  If I understand it correctly, it boils down to the simple premise that the candidate that receives the most votes should win the election.  </p>
<p>It will also force candidates to campaign everywhere.  Currently they ignore most of the country and focus exclusively on battleground states.  This skews the campaign so they discuss issues like the US-Cuba relationship because it is important in Florida.  The US-Mexico relationship is virtually ignored because candidates don&#8217;t have to campaign in California, or Texas.</p>
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