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Audacity of Truth
"Change" You Can Believe In:
"Nixon didn’t try to do that. They couldn't control (the media). They didn’t try. [...] What the hell do they think we are, puppets?"
- Liberal opinion writer Helen Thomas, describing the Obama admin's penchant for heavily scripting public appearances & press conferences - 7/1/09
Who’s really lying about Iraq?
Norman Podhoretz pens this must-read piece which answers that question, with detail after detail after detail. Print it out and read it and pass on the link to others.
I’d like to say that I’m shocked that Democrats are trying to pull the wool over the eyes of the American people with their bogus claims that the President ‘lied’ about Iraq’s WMD programs, but I’m really not. When you can’t win elections year after year, this is what the opposition is reduced to. And unfortunately the polls out there show that the Democrat’s propaganda campaign against this President regarding the Iraq war is, sadly, working.
Thanks to FT for the heads up on this article. Baklava posted a link to it last night as well.
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26 Responses to “Who’s really lying about Iraq?”
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Disclaimer: The views expressed on this blog do not necessarily reflect those of ST's advertisers, nor do their opinions necessarily reflect ST's. Stats
The polls are “out there” all right; they phrase their stupid questions to get the answers the want…and the “sheeple” buy right into it, too.
camojack, those are push polls. Only unscruplous people use or cite them as their main arguments.
Thanks for the mention!
Most Conservatives/Republicans are completely unable to understand what the issue is. The issue is not whether or not Iraq was considered a threat. The issue is, did the Bush administration misrepresent intelligence in order to justify going to war? Quoting different people does nothing to show that this didn’t happen. The article does nothing at all to prove or disprove that anyone in the administration did not present false information in order to make the case for going to war. I find it sad that conservatives need to hide behind Hillary Clinton and John Kerry instead of accounting for what the President and his administration did in leading this country into a war.
What did the President do Brian?? He used the inteligence at hand. Even gave credit to the source of some of that inteligence i.e. “the British Inteligence”. We aren’t hiding behind Hillary of John Kerry for anything. We know that Iraq was a threat to it’s neighbors, we know that he had in his possession chemical and biological weapons, and according to some of the findings of Hans Blix, was working on delivery systems for those weapons. We know that he had associations with terror organizations such as Hamas. We know that he ordered his military to challenge the no fly zone and the “DMZ” so to speak. We know that our pilots who flew that zone would constantly destroy military equipment that was not suppose to be in these areas, and yes even the Clinton adminstration had this problem. We now know the extent of the criminality that Hussien was willing to go to, Oil for Food program. Plus we now know that some of our “Allies” sold hi-tech weapons systems to Hussien which was against UN resolutions. How did President Bush manipulate the inteligence when some of it was from other countries?? France, Britan and Italy were all under the same belief. Sadamn Hussein was a threat and if he was allowed to continue to rule Iraq he would of eventually been a nuclear threat. It was only a matter of time before someone somewhere sold him the yellow cake he needed. Or perhaps he had another reason to have Dual Purpose explosives.
I love how I am incapable of understanding anything. How I cannot see the “whole” picture. Yet I don’t cling to the 1 thing that is in question. What I think is sad is the extent of deception people who cling to that 1 issue are. LOL You crack me up Brian.
Lorica, I don’t know how come you make so much sense. It must be some ability of conservatives to string points together that only mean something to us!
While Brian doesn’t know and his question has an accusation in it (in a time of war) we know but we must be knee jerk even though we’ve read over a thousand pages of information.
Brian, you can’t understand anything. If welfare was cutoff, would you starve?
During the past week I have extensively web searched actual documents and public disclosures relating to the charge that President Bush misused intellegence in justifying the Iraq war. In the process have found and read material that backs up every sentence of the 10/11 post by Brian.
Much more can be said about the fraudulant charges by Joe Wilson that started the “Bush Lied” frenzy.
Lorica,
Your comments show that you don’t understand the issue. You also don’t know what the facts are. Iraq did not have in its possession, chemical or biological weapons. You don’t understand the difference between “was intelligence misrepresented by the president or anyone in his administration?” and “was it the right decision to go to war?”. The issue being discussed is “was intelligence misrepresented by the president or anyone in his administration?” and you continue to comment on “was it the right decision to go to war?”. They are both two completely different issues.
Both you and Baklava want every decision made by the president related to going to war and carrying out the war to be accepted without question. Americans overwhelmingly disagree with you on this. Both you and Baklava don’t think it matters whether or not the president or anyone in his administration was dishonest in making the case to go to war. Americans overwhelmingly disagree with you on this issue too. Both you and Baklava think that by quoting different people saying Iraq was a threat or Iraq had nuclear or chemical weapons, it proves that the administration did not misrepresent intelligence. It doesn’t.
Brian, the name is Lorica, not Lonica. You have (intentionally?) spelled his name wrong several times. Please make a note of this for future reference. I edited in this instance. –ST
Baklava,
I find it very unlikely that you read “over a thousand pages of information”. I also find it very unlikely that you read much legitimate information. I find it much more likely that most of what you read was right wing propaganda such as this article by Norman Podhoretz.
The reason why what Lonica wrote makes so much sense to you, is because you have just as poor as an understanding of the issue as she does. You also both want every decision made by the president related to going to war and carrying out the war to be accepted without question.
If you are going to claim that there was no intelligence misrepresented in making the case for going to war, then provide evidence supporting the claims made by the president and his administration. Quoting Hillary Clinton and John Kerry does not prove anything one way or the other.
Sister Toldjah,
I didn’t notice that Lorica’s name was spelled with an “r” and not an “n”. My mispelling was unintentional. Thank you for pointing this out.
Do you find PCD’s comment about welfare to be related to this topic or appropriate in this discussion?
LOL Brian You are a funny funny man.
1st Lorica = Male Sister in her correction post to you knows I am a man. How did you confuse me for a female?? Or do you only read that which affirms your specific view point??
2nd Who did I quote in my post?? Outside of the President’s state of the union address who do I quote?? How do I not understand the issue?? Why does every issue boil down to the 1 issue you want to talk about. Everything I quote above is a fact Brian. We have found chemical weapons in Falujah when we took it over. The final State department report says that although none were found, there is a definate possiblilty that Sadamn did not destroy them like he was suppose to. That is why we still find artillery shells that are marked Chem or Bio. As I said Hans Blix found a remote drone that was rigged to spray Chemicals. Please Brian I understand the issue quite well. That don’t even include the dozens of soldiers I have talked to and gained info from. I am not the one who doesn’t understand. But whatever gets you to sleep at night Sir. – Lorica
Quote “If we attempt to take over Baghdad we will need 25,000 bodybags”
Theres a quote for ya Brian. Now can you tell me who said it??
Lorica says there were chemical weapons in Iraq because… Lorica says so.
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!!!!!
That was a funny one Lorica!
Four months after Charles A. Duelfer, who led the weapons hunt in 2004, submitted an interim report to Congress that contradicted nearly every prewar assertion about Iraq made by top Bush administration officials, a senior intelligence official said the findings will stand as the ISG’s final conclusions and will be published this spring. (see below link)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A2129-2005Jan11.html
Why did these people waste all their time and money looking for chemical and biological weapons? Why didn’t they just ask Lorica?!
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!!!!!
Brian wrote, “Both you and Baklava want ..”
You don’t know what I want.
Brian wrote, “Both you and Baklava don’t think… ”
You don’t know what I think.
Brian wrote, “I find it very unlikely that you read”
You don’t know what I’ve read.
Brian wrote, ” You also both want..”
You don’t know what I want.
The fundamental problem with your views (as represented by yourself) is that you THINK you KNOW what is in people’s minds. You’ll dismiss people like Norman and tell us you know what we think or want, when what you write isn’t what we think or want. You do a very bad job at understanding what we communicate as you aren’t representing my own views back to me very well at all.
I believe it was you that I wrote a car company example to in order to help you understand the problem with your argument. Car company Iraq made a fool out of everyone Brian. Now you are going to hop up and say, “Insert Empty Rhetoric Here”
Do you remember the car company example? Can you tell me what’s wrong with the example? Why doesn’t it move you off of your obsession?
Yes I am well aware of the Duelfer report Brian. Even have it downloaded onto my computer, as when I read it I don’t like to get it filtered thru the bias of the MSM. I like to read a lot of different papers, and I will never trust the NY Times or the Wash Post. Both have proven their bias pretty severly. So to answer your questions here are some of the things I have read and a new item with the Polish military.
Polish Troops
http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/2004-07-01-poland-iraq-sarin_x.htm
Sarin Gas artillary shell IED
http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0521/p09s01-coop.html
Sarin Gas found in Fallujah (click over to 2nd picture)
http://www.usatoday.com/news/graphics/phantom_fury/flash.htm
Mass Graves
http://www.defendamerica.mil/specials/june2003/ReignOfTerror/MassGraves.html
More Mass Graves found
http://washingtontimes.com/upi-breaking/20041013-073535-6643r.htm
Some of this is old, and some of it is newer. But atleast I am next expecting anyone to “take my word” on it. And it shows that Sadamn might of not has stockpiles, but there were still WMDs in Iraq. – Lorica
Which I’ve said many times too. WMD’s were found just not in the quantity of stockpiles.
Brian, are you a drone? You can’t reason and you can’t refute. You just repeat your stupidity over and over again.
Hussein had WMD and used it against the Kurds and against Iran. Saddam never proved to anyone that he got rid of it and how. If he didn’t have it, then why stonewall like he did?
Brian, you are a fool, and nothing more.
Baklava,
If you don’t want every decision President Bush has made, regarding Iraq, to be accepted without question, why do condemn anyone who questions or criticizes his policies regarding Iraq?
Buying a car and going to war in Iraq have nothing to do with each other. Trying to compare the two trivializes what is going on in Iraq.
You don’t seem to understand that the situation we are in now, in Iraq, was not unavoidable. The reason the situation has become so bad there is because President Bush has made many poor decision.
Lorica,
The artillery shell containing Sarin was made before 1991 which was before Saddam was disarmed.
If Saddam Hussein had chemical or biological weapons, do you really think he would let the American troops march right to Baghdad and overthrow his government without using them?
PCD,
You should not get so upset every time you lose an argument, or are proven wrong, and start attacking other people.
Brian I am well aware of when that artillary round was made. It was even tagged with a destruction date. The fact of the matter is that it was not destroyed. It was used by terrorists, and was found in Iraq. Now the question is how many more WMDs are in Iraq. Anyway I answered your question. – Lorica
Brian, you have not beaten me. Only your blind assertions to the contrary are what you think win. You never refuted any evidence except for one sarin shell. How do you explain the buried centrifuge that Iraq wasn’t supposed to have that was capable of doing Uranium isotope separation? No WMD programs, bah! What about those intercepted phone calls between Iraqi generals concerning moving WMD? What about all those truck convoys to Syria before the war? Well, brian??
Brian,
Google this: “al Qaeda in Mesopotamia”
Mesopotamia is what soms MSM is using for IRAQ. Now, tell me there was no link.
Ohhh and to answer your question about using them. I don’t really think he could of. I believe the sandstorm our troops suffered thru was sent at a critical time. It just wasn’t possible for Sadamn to fire artillary when he was facing that sandstorm. By the time the sandstorm ended most of the higher adminstration people and Command Staff had run off to Syria or into hiding thru out the country. But that is just my theory too. I have no idea why exactly Sadamn didn’t use the weapons he had. Why did he bury his Migs?? Why did he hide all that cash?? What was it 4 billion dollars US, and 1 billion in Euros?? Who can truly understand the mind of the insane. – Lorica
He hid all that cash because he didn’t want us evil americans to take it from him. He wanted to feed his people and give them medicine….